i have a question for all you serving members
12-02-2003, 08:56 PM
#1
rock stock
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: dub-bizzle, mass
Age: 44
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i have a question for all you serving members
there is alot of controversy in the news now about how the pres. went too iraq for thanksgiving. there is alot of bs about how he shouldnt have gone there, that he did this for his own personal benefit, that he is risking peoples lives for nothing. i dont want too start a bad topic, but i want too no waht you men and women think. you are the ones serving orders from the president in a way. what do you feel about how **** is going.
thanks for everything,
matt
thanks for everything,
matt
12-02-2003, 09:49 PM
#3
I Chose to No Longer Post
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Age: 42
Posts: 6,267
This is the way I look at it Matt: Mr. Bush may have done it to better his re-election campaign... or not... regardless he made a lot of people who were probably having a shitty day happy. It's that simple. Intentions besides, it's the effect of what was done that matters the most.
Plus, his security is so good that I bet the number of people that knew he was going was in the single digits even upon arrival at the airport in Iraq. He was in, made a speech, served a bunch of people turkey and was out within a couple of hours.
I don't see what he did as being dangerous or wrong in the least bit. What he did makes me proud to serve this country, and serve my Commander in Chief.
-Erik
Plus, his security is so good that I bet the number of people that knew he was going was in the single digits even upon arrival at the airport in Iraq. He was in, made a speech, served a bunch of people turkey and was out within a couple of hours.
I don't see what he did as being dangerous or wrong in the least bit. What he did makes me proud to serve this country, and serve my Commander in Chief.
-Erik
12-02-2003, 11:16 PM
#4
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Location: Alaska/Virginia
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Well, i think he just got himself re-elected....that was a ballzy thing he did, and i think that it was wonderful for our fellow brothers over there it probably brought out some light on the ones that had heads down over the hoilday......that someone as powerful as himself took a chance that to go there and let them know that there are other people thinking of them right now. just my 2 cents
12-03-2003, 12:56 PM
#5
rock stock
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cool guys, i just wanted too ask your opinion on this subject since there is alot of controversy. i figured that he went there too give the troops something too be happy about for once. i no it must suck *** too be there, away from family and ****. i am happy that he did make the people there happy and let them no that we are all proud of them for what they are doing too protect us back in the states.
thanks guys
thanks guys
12-06-2003, 03:35 PM
#6
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Ft. Stewart, outside Savannah, GA
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Thats all bullshit... The pres might seem to care, but he doesn't. He didn't care when he started the war, he didn't care when the war was over and people were still being killed on a daily basis, and he doesn't care now. He puts on a good show, and says the right things, but thats all it is to him. We are merely means to an end. He wanted saddam out, and if a few of my friends got killed and maimed in the process, that's just the price we pay.
He's been spoon fed his whole life, had everything placed before him on a silver platter. He doesn't have any idea the amount of suffering his little war caused. Americans are still being killed on a daily basis, and what was his response? "Bring it on" That's doesn't sound like something someone would say if they really cared about the people dying daily.
He's the number one reason I'm getting out. The army's alright, it's a decent job, awesome benefits, and I've got plenty of memories and stories, both great and terrible.
I'm not just some pawn though, I refuse to be. If we were actually fighting to protect our freedom, I would be proud to fight.
I fought for the Iraqi's freedom, I lost friends in the process, and I am not proud at all.
The thanksgiving ploy was just that, a ploy. I've seen him 3 times now since I've been at Ft stewart. Once in Kosovo and 2ce here, and all 3 times it was nothing but misery. We HAD to go see him speak, and of course we had to show up 2 hours early to stand around and wait for him. And of course just showing up wasn't good enough, we had to march over to the field 2 miles away, so we had to leave the unit at 6 in the morn... 2 of the times I was actually standing behind bleachers and couldn't see a damn thing. It's not a morale booster at all, it's usually a morale drain when he comes around.
Be proud of the soldiers, be proud of what they're doing, but don't buy into the misconception that it's protecting us here. What they are doing is only helping Bush's agenda in the mideast, whatever that may be.
F\/CK Bush, F\/ck the army, and f\/ck you if you don't like it... Quit buying all the propaganda and think for yourself and you might understand me.
Ok, somebody take the soapbox away, I could go on all day!!
He's been spoon fed his whole life, had everything placed before him on a silver platter. He doesn't have any idea the amount of suffering his little war caused. Americans are still being killed on a daily basis, and what was his response? "Bring it on" That's doesn't sound like something someone would say if they really cared about the people dying daily.
He's the number one reason I'm getting out. The army's alright, it's a decent job, awesome benefits, and I've got plenty of memories and stories, both great and terrible.
I'm not just some pawn though, I refuse to be. If we were actually fighting to protect our freedom, I would be proud to fight.
I fought for the Iraqi's freedom, I lost friends in the process, and I am not proud at all.
The thanksgiving ploy was just that, a ploy. I've seen him 3 times now since I've been at Ft stewart. Once in Kosovo and 2ce here, and all 3 times it was nothing but misery. We HAD to go see him speak, and of course we had to show up 2 hours early to stand around and wait for him. And of course just showing up wasn't good enough, we had to march over to the field 2 miles away, so we had to leave the unit at 6 in the morn... 2 of the times I was actually standing behind bleachers and couldn't see a damn thing. It's not a morale booster at all, it's usually a morale drain when he comes around.
Be proud of the soldiers, be proud of what they're doing, but don't buy into the misconception that it's protecting us here. What they are doing is only helping Bush's agenda in the mideast, whatever that may be.
F\/CK Bush, F\/ck the army, and f\/ck you if you don't like it... Quit buying all the propaganda and think for yourself and you might understand me.
Ok, somebody take the soapbox away, I could go on all day!!
12-06-2003, 07:39 PM
#9
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It was a virus thread that shugga started as a joke that turned everyones avatar to vannila ice that posted in the thread.
Does anyone think that busch would have went to iraq if it wasnt election time?? IMO he is a idiot, pure and simple. The man takes more vacations then ANY other president ever took. He is lazy and has been spoon fed his entire life...
Does anyone think that busch would have went to iraq if it wasnt election time?? IMO he is a idiot, pure and simple. The man takes more vacations then ANY other president ever took. He is lazy and has been spoon fed his entire life...
12-06-2003, 08:25 PM
#10
I Chose to No Longer Post
Join Date: Dec 2002
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Posts: 6,267
Originally posted by ENASNI900RR
Does anyone think that busch would have went to iraq if it wasnt election time?? IMO he is a idiot, pure and simple.
Does anyone think that busch would have went to iraq if it wasnt election time?? IMO he is a idiot, pure and simple.
12-14-2003, 11:09 AM
#11
Regular StuntLifer
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Heinsberg, Germany
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ZED K......how long you been in? You sound like some little 19-20 year with the whole "the military is here to *** me" attitude......
I think you are making the right decision though about getting out because narrow sightedness is something that military members don't need. I cant tell you the Presidents plans are nor would I ask you what they were cause you don't know, but on the other hand you to say that Thanksgiving was a big ploy....ignorance is bliss bro!!!!!!
And to answer a question you may have for me, yes I did have friends.....close friends........that passed away during this whole ordeal.
I think you are making the right decision though about getting out because narrow sightedness is something that military members don't need. I cant tell you the Presidents plans are nor would I ask you what they were cause you don't know, but on the other hand you to say that Thanksgiving was a big ploy....ignorance is bliss bro!!!!!!
And to answer a question you may have for me, yes I did have friends.....close friends........that passed away during this whole ordeal.
12-14-2003, 12:24 PM
#12
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Location: Ft. Stewart, outside Savannah, GA
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6 years now. Made staff sergeant at 5, and no matter what I think, I still lead my team to the best of my ability. I may hate the army, I may be disgusted by the president, but I still signed that contract and will do what I've sworn to do. I don’t talk about this at work either. Gotta set the good example right?
Narrow minded? Try open minded, but it's still the wrong mindset for the army. The military wants narrow minded troops, just they want narrow minded troops that are narrow the way they want. I refuse to be propagandised like most. I never bought the war before during or after. It never made any sense.
We were attacking Saddam because he supposedly had some chemical weapons and ties to al queda. Both turned out to be false. Korea however, has TOLD us that they are working on nukes (last December they were supposedly months away from having nuclear warheads), and they have missiles that can reach American soil. Which sounds like a bigger threat to you? I hate war, but I think that if one really needed to be fought last march, it should have been in Korea, not Iraq.
Would I have lost friends in Korea? Probably many more than I did, but I would have understood it. They would have been fighting to protect America from an actual threat instead of chasing ghosts across the Iraqi countryside.
A week before we crossed into Iraq, BG Austin, the 3d ID assistant division commander, came to talk to my battalion. He gave a pretty good motivational speech, but he didn't say anything about chem weapons, he didn't say anything about al queda, he didn't say anything about threats to America. He said that Saddam had killed probably millions of his own people, women and kids included, and he was a truly bad man and needed to be caught and killed. He knew all the other stuff was BS, and tried to get us pumped another way. The thing I don't get is if that’s the standard for invading and taking over foreign countries, why aren't we in Korea, china, 3/4 of the African countries, and 1/4 of the South American countries? Iraqi freedom... That’s not a good enough reason to take over a country.
So when Bush showed up in Iraq, trying to boost moral over there, with all the video cameras rolling showing the world the good president serving his troops, I believe all he cared about was the cameras and election day 2004. To me it wasn't a moral booster, it was a slap in the face. To use honorable men and women to bolster his image as the CINC is about as dishonorable as possible. If he really cared he wouldn't have said “bring it on” in response to the frequent guerilla attacks that keep killing soldiers.
We are all pawns. You, me, BG Austin, every single person wearing a uniform is a pawn. You might have a little bit of authority over those under you, and your little realm of existence, but when the pres said jump, we all said how high. I’m sorry, but the benefits just don’t outweigh the negatives. I don’t see how any self respecting man can listen to the facts and still be proud of the president or his little war in Iraq. Or be willing to do his bidding again! Not me. If you can, I say you’re brainwashed. Or uninformed, which is just as bad, if not worse. If brainwashed you can hear the facts and not be persuaded by them. Uninformed means you don’t even care what the facts are, you just mindlessly do whatever your told.
On a positive note, Saddam's been caught! Hopefully now the resistance will start to die out and freedom can take hold.
Narrow minded? Try open minded, but it's still the wrong mindset for the army. The military wants narrow minded troops, just they want narrow minded troops that are narrow the way they want. I refuse to be propagandised like most. I never bought the war before during or after. It never made any sense.
We were attacking Saddam because he supposedly had some chemical weapons and ties to al queda. Both turned out to be false. Korea however, has TOLD us that they are working on nukes (last December they were supposedly months away from having nuclear warheads), and they have missiles that can reach American soil. Which sounds like a bigger threat to you? I hate war, but I think that if one really needed to be fought last march, it should have been in Korea, not Iraq.
Would I have lost friends in Korea? Probably many more than I did, but I would have understood it. They would have been fighting to protect America from an actual threat instead of chasing ghosts across the Iraqi countryside.
A week before we crossed into Iraq, BG Austin, the 3d ID assistant division commander, came to talk to my battalion. He gave a pretty good motivational speech, but he didn't say anything about chem weapons, he didn't say anything about al queda, he didn't say anything about threats to America. He said that Saddam had killed probably millions of his own people, women and kids included, and he was a truly bad man and needed to be caught and killed. He knew all the other stuff was BS, and tried to get us pumped another way. The thing I don't get is if that’s the standard for invading and taking over foreign countries, why aren't we in Korea, china, 3/4 of the African countries, and 1/4 of the South American countries? Iraqi freedom... That’s not a good enough reason to take over a country.
So when Bush showed up in Iraq, trying to boost moral over there, with all the video cameras rolling showing the world the good president serving his troops, I believe all he cared about was the cameras and election day 2004. To me it wasn't a moral booster, it was a slap in the face. To use honorable men and women to bolster his image as the CINC is about as dishonorable as possible. If he really cared he wouldn't have said “bring it on” in response to the frequent guerilla attacks that keep killing soldiers.
We are all pawns. You, me, BG Austin, every single person wearing a uniform is a pawn. You might have a little bit of authority over those under you, and your little realm of existence, but when the pres said jump, we all said how high. I’m sorry, but the benefits just don’t outweigh the negatives. I don’t see how any self respecting man can listen to the facts and still be proud of the president or his little war in Iraq. Or be willing to do his bidding again! Not me. If you can, I say you’re brainwashed. Or uninformed, which is just as bad, if not worse. If brainwashed you can hear the facts and not be persuaded by them. Uninformed means you don’t even care what the facts are, you just mindlessly do whatever your told.
On a positive note, Saddam's been caught! Hopefully now the resistance will start to die out and freedom can take hold.
12-17-2003, 12:32 AM
#13
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Yup Zed it seems you have other **** your dealing with besides doing what the hell your trained for. How bout just doing it and shutting your pie hole. If you didnt want to fight for your country why did you even join?? I was at the L.O.D and ya know what motivational speech we recieved?? Nada zip zilch.
12-17-2003, 04:06 PM
#14
rock stock
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i dunno man, i think i like the service and i wish i had taken car of my body well enough that i could serve now. broken back and bone spurrs from when i broke both my feet are ruining my chances too serve my country. well, i do what i can for my country and i believe taht bush is doing what is best. zedk, i would leave if you have such a negative attitude towards the whole military. you cant fight with full devotion if you dont want too be there. it might be putting other soldiers lives at stake for the worse
12-17-2003, 07:59 PM
#15
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Location: Ft. Stewart, outside Savannah, GA
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OK, you guys got hung up on my principles and missed the beginning huh? I'm still a damn fine soldier, and will be until I get out. If Bush decides to fight another war before I can ETS I'll fight that one too. Not because of Bush or any of his off the wall reasoning for fighting wars, but because I am a leader who has troops who depend on me.
I was just trying to get my reasoning across, if you're not smart enough to understand it, stay in, I'm sure you'll be a great platoon sgt one day if you don't retire first. There's nothing wrong with retireing as a staff sergeant. Really!
What unit were you with on the LOD? I was with 2nd BN 7th INF of the 3rd ID, the most highly decorated infantry battalion in the army. Fought in every war since the Revolutionary war back in 1776.
My battalion alone had more people killed by enemy fire than the entire 2nd brigade 3ID. You remember the suicide car bomb that totally changed the ROE when it killed 4 guys while we sat and resupplied south of Karbala? A Co 2-7INF. My company. You heard about the engineer E-7 who's been put in for the Congressional Medal of Honor? He was 200 meters up the road from me when he was killed as we took the airport, his company was attached to my battalion. So try and say I'm a pogue because I got a motivational speech mutherfuc ker. I don't want to hear your shi t. All my team came home in one piece too, so don't give me thatshi t about endangering troops.
I fought and served honorably with the best, and will continue to do so until I get out. I'm entitled to be disgruntled. It's not that I don't want to fight. I don't want to fight for no reason, and no one should. If you watch the news, read some history, learn a little bit about why Bush sent us to Iraq, and are mildly intelligent, I promise you would be disgruntled too. We killed a s hitload of people just because Bush said he wanted to.
Come back with something intelllegent and I'll consider it. Otherwise, let the thread die a peaceful death of old age.
I was just trying to get my reasoning across, if you're not smart enough to understand it, stay in, I'm sure you'll be a great platoon sgt one day if you don't retire first. There's nothing wrong with retireing as a staff sergeant. Really!
What unit were you with on the LOD? I was with 2nd BN 7th INF of the 3rd ID, the most highly decorated infantry battalion in the army. Fought in every war since the Revolutionary war back in 1776.
My battalion alone had more people killed by enemy fire than the entire 2nd brigade 3ID. You remember the suicide car bomb that totally changed the ROE when it killed 4 guys while we sat and resupplied south of Karbala? A Co 2-7INF. My company. You heard about the engineer E-7 who's been put in for the Congressional Medal of Honor? He was 200 meters up the road from me when he was killed as we took the airport, his company was attached to my battalion. So try and say I'm a pogue because I got a motivational speech mutherfuc ker. I don't want to hear your shi t. All my team came home in one piece too, so don't give me thatshi t about endangering troops.
I fought and served honorably with the best, and will continue to do so until I get out. I'm entitled to be disgruntled. It's not that I don't want to fight. I don't want to fight for no reason, and no one should. If you watch the news, read some history, learn a little bit about why Bush sent us to Iraq, and are mildly intelligent, I promise you would be disgruntled too. We killed a s hitload of people just because Bush said he wanted to.
Come back with something intelllegent and I'll consider it. Otherwise, let the thread die a peaceful death of old age.
Last edited by Zed K; 12-17-2003 at 08:08 PM.
12-17-2003, 08:49 PM
#16
I Chose to No Longer Post
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Posts: 6,267
I dunno, this ZedK guy sure sounds like he knows his ****. He sure sounds like he does his job to the best of his ability. Why gie him **** about having an opinion? You get one dont you? Sit down and Shut Up. Semper Fi, ERIK
12-18-2003, 03:29 AM
#17
I Enjoy Posting At StuntLife!
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Zed K
My battalion alone had more people killed by enemy fire than the entire 2nd brigade 3ID. You remember the suicide car bomb that totally changed the ROE when it killed 4 guys while we sat and resupplied south of Karbala? A Co 2-7INF. My company. You heard about the engineer E-7 who's been put in for the Congressional Medal of Honor? He was 200 meters up the road from me when he was killed as we took the airport, his company was attached to my battalion. So try and say I'm a pogue because I got a motivational speech mutherfuc ker. I don't want to hear your shi t. All my team came home in one piece too, so don't give me thatshi t about endangering troops.
ok first off dog, you do have freedom of speech and you have that because of people like us fighting for it. You do have a shitty attitude about the military and of Bush, I have a solution for your problem. Why don't you just chain your tree hugging hippy ***** *** to a tree and kill yourself! You are a staright up bitch. How the **** can you sit here and use the people in your battalion that were KIA as your ****ing Escape Goat for your shitty out look on Bush and on the War? I have tons of RESPECT for your Men and every other person that was KIA and that will be KIA during all this. I was over there, I know a lot of Marines, 1/2 C company that were KIA during the war. They took an OATH and they did what they were supposed to do. Why not look at them as HEROS instead of using them as your ****ing ESCAPE GOAT. So stop your ****ing
My battalion alone had more people killed by enemy fire than the entire 2nd brigade 3ID. You remember the suicide car bomb that totally changed the ROE when it killed 4 guys while we sat and resupplied south of Karbala? A Co 2-7INF. My company. You heard about the engineer E-7 who's been put in for the Congressional Medal of Honor? He was 200 meters up the road from me when he was killed as we took the airport, his company was attached to my battalion. So try and say I'm a pogue because I got a motivational speech mutherfuc ker. I don't want to hear your shi t. All my team came home in one piece too, so don't give me thatshi t about endangering troops.
ok first off dog, you do have freedom of speech and you have that because of people like us fighting for it. You do have a shitty attitude about the military and of Bush, I have a solution for your problem. Why don't you just chain your tree hugging hippy ***** *** to a tree and kill yourself! You are a staright up bitch. How the **** can you sit here and use the people in your battalion that were KIA as your ****ing Escape Goat for your shitty out look on Bush and on the War? I have tons of RESPECT for your Men and every other person that was KIA and that will be KIA during all this. I was over there, I know a lot of Marines, 1/2 C company that were KIA during the war. They took an OATH and they did what they were supposed to do. Why not look at them as HEROS instead of using them as your ****ing ESCAPE GOAT. So stop your ****ing
12-18-2003, 09:01 AM
#18
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Location: Ft. Stewart, outside Savannah, GA
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How the **** can you sit here and use the people in your battalion that were KIA as your ****ing Escape Goat for your shitty out look on Bush and on the War?
The people I fought with who were killed are not my scape goat (thats what you meant, right? or were you talking about your goat that ran away?). My reason for hating Bush and the war is simple, and I'll try to keep in single syllable words for you.
IT MADE NO SENSE!!
You remember why we attacked? Because Bush gave Iraq an ultimatum: Give up all your weapons of mass destruction, or we will come take them from you. You remember what Iraq said? We don't have any WMD. They've all been destroyed.
Bush didn't believe them, so we attacked.
Have we found and WMD yet? Have we found any ties to Al Queda? Have we done anything positive other than free the Iraqi people? Is freeing people living in fear reason enough to fight a war? If so, lets start fighting, because HALF THE WORLD lives in fear of their leadership!!
Go chain your brain dead self to a tree and kill YOURSELF bitch, and quit breathing my air. At the very least go get a vasectomy, because you are too stupid to have kids.
12-18-2003, 06:47 PM
#19
I Enjoy Posting At StuntLife!
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Originally posted by Zed K
Go chain your brain dead self to a tree and kill YOURSELF bitch, and quit breathing my air. At the very least go get a vasectomy, because you are too stupid to have kids.
Go chain your brain dead self to a tree and kill YOURSELF bitch, and quit breathing my air. At the very least go get a vasectomy, because you are too stupid to have kids.
Zed K Last edited by fabes; 12-18-2003 at 06:51 PM.
12-18-2003, 06:53 PM
#20
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Posts: 6,267
What's with the gay thing? I don't remember him saying he was gay. Oh , I get it, you're probably insinuating that because you don't have a real response to his well though out and well executed replies. I think this guys is whats GOOD for the military: (1) He has his OWN opinion. (2) He (seams) to do his job to the best of his ability, from what he said coupled with the fact that he picked up Staff Sergeant in 5 years (3) He never said anything about bashing his chain of command infront of his troops, so obviously he keeps his thoughts to himself (4) He only voices his opinions when in an appropriate forum (like this one). So fabes, why dont you drop your attitude and show some respect. No one is bashing your for having an opinion!
