Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 687
From: Kansas
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Length of fork, from stem bolt to the center of the axle while on the front wheel is also a factor. If you're on a f4i front end and it fully compresses, it could be really short and account for the nasty tank slappers. A 954 front might not compress much compared to the f4i, thus giving it the added stability. There are several factors, initial rake/trail/fork length and the length of the fork compressed while it is on the front wheel supporting all the weight. Once these are determined, there is no reason the stock forks wouldn't give the same feel as the inverted setups. If a f4i's forks are a full 2 inches shorter than a 954 while on the front wheel, it would explain the super-aggressive front geometry and the lack of overall stability.
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,078
From: Brockton, Ma
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Originally Posted by Matt Gorka
I would love to see 2 bikes, side by side. One with 954 setup, one with a stock front end and take measurements and duplicate it on the stock setup...
Same spring rates. Same rake/trail. Same fork length. I think this is a job for Race Tech. This needs to be settled once and for all. Swapping out the front end doesn't affect the weight balance of the bike. The motor is still in the same place, etc. It's all to do with the goemetry of the front end that enables it to hook up better, and the spring rates give it the sturdy feel. There is nothing so far that leads me to believe that it can't be replicated with the stockers.
Same spring rates. Same rake/trail. Same fork length. I think this is a job for Race Tech. This needs to be settled once and for all. Swapping out the front end doesn't affect the weight balance of the bike. The motor is still in the same place, etc. It's all to do with the goemetry of the front end that enables it to hook up better, and the spring rates give it the sturdy feel. There is nothing so far that leads me to believe that it can't be replicated with the stockers.
J Blox
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,641
From: Mobile, Abalama
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
I've rode quite a few diff bikes. And just bought a F4i with a 929 front end on it last month. Im not king kong stoppie man, but i've notice just from hard accel to braking when i first jumped on it it wanted to buck me up into a stoppie. Might be the way the fork is setup to the bikes center of gravity. but **** what do i know
Came back-it's still wack
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,863
From: Roanoke, VA
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
I took my front end (Stock F4i) ran 1.0 Race tech springs, 15 weight oil (2 steps heavier), had a certified suspension tech guy revalve the forks for a slower rebound to reduce pogo, and I dropped the forks down in the triples a bit. My front end feels great right now, Real smooth and solid without pogo-ing. The Stock lower triple could be less flexy, but whateva... I like my setup now.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 687
From: Kansas
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Originally Posted by MannyFresh954
if you put an f4i with a 954 front end on it next to a stock f4i, the one with the 954 front end will sit higher in the front....it makes them higher/taller in the front, so you have to lower them about 1-2inches in the front.....
That would explain why it's more stable. So, what I'm seeing is the stock front end sags too much and the tubes compress into the forks causing a much more radical front end than the 954 setup. Plus, it's mushy and that would explain the pogo and tankslaps.
www.myspace.com/emrock
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,469
From: Tampa,FL
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Originally Posted by MannyFresh954
if you put an f4i with a 954 front end on it next to a stock f4i, the one with the 954 front end will sit higher in the front....it makes them higher/taller in the front, so you have to lower them about 1-2inches in the front.....
u of m still sux
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,351
From: Detroit
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Originally Posted by -Nasty-
lets ask ryan cramer
i have no idea how to set up forks, i just left them alone
stock gixxer 600's felt different from my old 1000 but i could still hit 800, my big thing was allways using 2 steering dampers
more of a head game i think
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Joined: Aug 2004
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From: .......
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Originally Posted by Ryan Cramer
i have no idea how to set up forks, i just left them alone
stock gixxer 600's felt different from my old 1000 but i could still hit 800, my big thing was allways using 2 steering dampers
more of a head game i think
stock gixxer 600's felt different from my old 1000 but i could still hit 800, my big thing was allways using 2 steering dampers
more of a head game i think
Johnny seals had two for awhile I think.....and he had to handmake the bracket to put the one on the from of the forks!
Neither the 600RR I already have, nor the 1000RR I'm wanting to get have set-ups already made to be able to mount dampers to the front of the forks and only to the top of the triple clamps!
Guru
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 450
From: BAY AREA
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Originally Posted by Matt Gorka
Joe, your assignment is to get some springs done up in a f4i and mess with the forks to see what works since you're probably the ideal candidate for this test.
matt i think there are many problems with the stock f4i front end... clipon position head tube and triple rake width of the triples and bars and the forks are complete garbage..and the brakes and front master cylinder are a joke.. the f4i isnt even a good bike for stoppies even with a 929 front end...
Brap
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,417
From: Scottsdale, AZ
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Originally Posted by TongWoo
I took my front end (Stock F4i) ran 1.0 Race tech springs, 15 weight oil (2 steps heavier), had a certified suspension tech guy revalve the forks for a slower rebound to reduce pogo, and I dropped the forks down in the triples a bit. My front end feels great right now, Real smooth and solid without pogo-ing. The Stock lower triple could be less flexy, but whateva... I like my setup now.
Registered User
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,113
From: south central MA
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
now another questions (and this was touched on by teach)... i ride an 04 600rr now (non-radial) and the difference between my old F4 and this is night and day. i think its mostly to do with the brakes being better but i just bearly touch the thing and its at balance.
and to what cramer said, i was trying em without a damper and then i went out and bought one, and i dont notice a difference at all. now, i dont have the steering stopper gpr, but i do have one.
all in all, i think it all comes down to how quickly you can get it to balance and the motion it takes traveling there. also, body position is HUGE. my stoppies have been gettin better lately and it is all because of body position (locking your arms, head up, that type of ****)...
and to what cramer said, i was trying em without a damper and then i went out and bought one, and i dont notice a difference at all. now, i dont have the steering stopper gpr, but i do have one.
all in all, i think it all comes down to how quickly you can get it to balance and the motion it takes traveling there. also, body position is HUGE. my stoppies have been gettin better lately and it is all because of body position (locking your arms, head up, that type of ****)...
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 122
From: Sea town, WA
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
this thread is awesome!
i hope matt gorka is doing this homework to finsh the instructional stoppie vids...... i'm just kinda waiting for those DVD's to come out before i try any LONG stoppies!!!
if you do everything they say in the advanced wheelie vid you'll learn 12's without dumping your bike..(thank you for that one, matt, and kyle)
please have , joe b, jason b, and alex flores as special guests in your stoppie vid
i hope matt gorka is doing this homework to finsh the instructional stoppie vids...... i'm just kinda waiting for those DVD's to come out before i try any LONG stoppies!!!
if you do everything they say in the advanced wheelie vid you'll learn 12's without dumping your bike..(thank you for that one, matt, and kyle)please have , joe b, jason b, and alex flores as special guests in your stoppie vid
Retired
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 37,967
From: .
Re: Fork setups...Enough already!!!
Originally Posted by Stuntone0one
the lower the front of the ibke, the more weight there is on the front tire, and thus the harder it is to lock-up.
smae with lower clips-ons, the more weight you put over the front, the less likely to lock-up.
smae with lower clips-ons, the more weight you put over the front, the less likely to lock-up.
